Warning: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /home/johnband/sharpener.johnband.org/index.php:1) in /home/johnband/sharpener.johnband.org/wp-includes/feed-rss2-comments.php on line 8
Comments on: Little Netherlanders and Islamophobic buffoons http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/ Trying to make a point Fri, 25 Jan 2008 12:21:35 +0000 hourly 1 By: What You Can Get Away With » Carnival Of The Godless #15 http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/#comment-9565 Thu, 13 Apr 2006 16:41:27 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=69#comment-9565 […] Ah, this tent looks familiar, probably because it’s one I helped to put up. Yes, it’s John Band over at The Sharpener with an exhibition of Little Netherlanders and Islamophobic Buffoons, combining his usual skills of statistical analysis and rhetorical abuse. Hey, it’s a carnival so why not show off what you do best? […]

]]>
By: Anonymous http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/#comment-1348 Fri, 08 Jul 2005 10:48:29 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=69#comment-1348 This is one super duper site

]]>
By: Ron B http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/#comment-651 Sun, 12 Jun 2005 07:42:06 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=69#comment-651 Is it not ironic that the Government fears the Muslim population (War on Terror), but needs their vote? Hence we have the silly religious hatred bill.

]]>
By: Sean Fear http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/#comment-642 Sat, 11 Jun 2005 08:05:17 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=69#comment-642 Is it “drooling idiocy” to question whether the government’s daft incitement to religious hatred bill would ever have seen the light of day, were it not for the presence of a large Muslim population in Britain?

]]>
By: EU Serf http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/#comment-600 Thu, 09 Jun 2005 15:16:39 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=69#comment-600 On Pim Fortyn

Pim was gay, and prominent muslims were making comments that would be very offensive to anyone who was gay. He answered them back.

I know its not very nice to say some of the things he said, I find it hard to see what else he could have thought in his position.

]]>
By: john b http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/#comment-579 Tue, 07 Jun 2005 16:00:57 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=69#comment-579 Be careful before extrapolating too much from an apparent 1% shift in the US white population. The error on these kinds of numbers is significant – especially if they’re not from the same source, and extra-especially once journalists (rather than economists and statisticians) get their hands on them.

I’m pretty sure there’s no hard or convincing evidence to support the conjecture that France has 6 million Muslim Arabs (or any other number of Muslim Arabs) by the way. That was one of my points in the original post. Although if you do have a link to a credible source, it would be a very major help for the project I’m currently doing at work…

]]>
By: Monjo http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/#comment-578 Tue, 07 Jun 2005 15:47:28 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=69#comment-578 Nosemonkey: I think you miss the point of my stating the US figures, I mean by your definition everyone in Britain is an immigrant too. It is just a matter of timeframe.

The thing is the IMMIGRANT numbers may seem small. But immigrants have more children and over a few generations it drastically alters the racial/cultural breakdown of a nation. In just 15 years time, almost 20pc of under-18s in the UK will be children of immigrants; if the US and Germany have similar ratios (based on their current immigrant population sizes) then about 35pc of under-18s in America and 50pc in Germany will be children of immigrants. Now obviously these people are natives not immigrants, but if they are raised and use the customs, language and cultures of their parents rather than of their country then it will have huge consequences.

The US stat shows just how rapidly (5 years) it takes to see a whole 1pc shift in the racial breakdown of a country. Imagine we shift that to the UK, then in 15 years from now there’ll have been a 3pc decline in the number of whites as a total percentage of the population, and a 3pc increase of non-whites. Over a century this means a 20pc shift. Or by 2100 from 92pc white to 72pc white. If we take a look at France, it now has 6million Muslim Arabs, 10pc of the population, which has been a huge cultural shift since the 1950s.

]]>
By: john b http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/#comment-569 Tue, 07 Jun 2005 09:10:13 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=69#comment-569 Anon – excellent comment.

I suspect London has distorted my views of race relations in the UK, although by the same token I also suspect Bradford is an outlier (compare it with e.g. Leicester or Wolverhampton…)

Equally, I’m well aware this post won’t deter irrational, ill-informed people who blame the immigrants for all their problems from voting BNP (I lean towards the view that said people probably can’t read, and certainly won’t be looking at political commentary websites). It was more an attempt to see if Dutch racial politics can be viewed using the UK as a guide, with a few well-deserved insults against the racists thrown in largely for amusement value.

]]>
By: Anon http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/#comment-563 Tue, 07 Jun 2005 01:54:09 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=69#comment-563 I’m a teacher in Bradford so I think I can comment on the situation there. I have never voted for the Conservatives let alone the National Front, yet I know parents of my pupils who have. I also have a minority of Asian pupils, I’ll come to them later.

For your benefit, know that in Bradford, the schools are either overwhelmingly white or overwhelming Asian. There are few signs that this is changing.

There is a resentment amongst the white community because it perceives itself as being second class citizens as compared to the Asian citizens. They see themselves are getting all the blame and the Asians getting all the help. Of course this is largely untrue but enough is, to give credence to the falsehoods. Here’s an example.

Every year I organise tours of churchs, temples and mosques to develop trust. The vast majority of the white children attend all visits. Virtually none of my Asian children visit any religious building except their own. In the Asian parts of Bradford, the schools don’t even bother visiting churchs anymore. I make this observation, because it’s apparent to me that the tolerance is mainly one way.

The TV program that was postponed concerning Asians attacking White girls is mentioned frequently by parent, not because of the facts in the case, but because the media/government quickly brushed it under the carpet – “they’re never gonna do anything about it”.

In contrast my Asian youths complain about Islamophobia, yet no one knows anyone arrested for say suspicion of terrorism. The Moslem girls now all wear the veil. Some of this is no doubt because of a sense of community, but I know of two pupils who wear it because of the “risk” (their word) of doing otherwise. The risk does not come from whites.

What I see here is a community dividing upon ethic religious lines (and there is added complexity from the Hindu, Sikh, Islam mix). The only place similar to it that I have spent time is Belfast, yet I wouldn’t dream of saying such a thing at work. To do so would be too close to Enoch Powell. In fact to discuss any perceived problems with multiculturalism at work is a career limiting decision.

Ironically, London is very different – maybe the sheer size helps. I don’t know.

However, I do think that our failure as a country to be able to be able to discuss such matters in a rational intelligent way without resorting to either racism or name calling is an appalling development. The vilification of the Conservative Party by a Labour party, which proposed virtually identical immigration policies is a case in point: Pot Kettle Black.

Whilst I broadly agree with your article, its tone is completely wrong. If mainstream political parties (and I mean Labour) merely dismiss local concerns as the result of fearmongering, then they will lose the vote in places like Bradford. These people will never vote Conservative and they don’t read the Mail or the Telegraph. Yet the growing perception is that the Labour party (especially at the National level) is overwhelmingly middle class and out of touch.

Telling someone they are irrational may not be the best opening gambit to prevent them voting BNP.

]]>
By: Nosemonkey http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/06/little-netherlanders-and-islamophobic-buffoons/#comment-562 Mon, 06 Jun 2005 14:27:33 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=69#comment-562 Monjo – and white persons in the US aren’t immigrants how, exactly?

Childish point, perhaps, but an important one – the US is not a useful comparison when talking about European immigration – unless you think that the non-white immigrants to Europe are likely to embark on a programme of genocide against the native populations before rounding us up in economically-depressed rural ghettos and occasionally allowing us to run casinos, that is.

The only viable comparisons that can be made is between European countries. Nowhere else in the world – bar, perhaps, Japan – has got a similar back story. And Japan has both one of the smallest immigrant populations in the world and one of the biggest anti-immigrant tendencies (albeit a mostly non-violent, non-rabid one).

Xenophobia/racism/bigotry (or whatever you want to call it) doesn’t correspond to numbers – because it isn’t rational.

]]>