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Comments on: Time to move the capital http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/ Trying to make a point Fri, 25 Jan 2008 12:21:35 +0000 hourly 1 By: Davide Simonetti http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-14146 Mon, 29 May 2006 08:28:19 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/2006/05/24/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-14146 Wouldn’t moving the Government up north just shift the problem rather than tackle it? It might ease pressure on the south, but whatever unfortunate city that ended up hosting the Government would be sucked dry of resources just like in London. House prices would rise even more and locals would be forced out of their towns. I agree with Bishop Hill that power should be devolved to local governments spreading the load more evenly.

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By: Muppetlord http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13873 Thu, 25 May 2006 18:00:16 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/2006/05/24/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13873 Are you out of your mind? We don’t want those incompetant government bureaucrats up here, we already have too many as it is….

I admit that seeing the look on all the socialites faces when they have to move outside of their little bubble would be quite satisfying…especially as they think we are still in the dark ages….

Surprising that all the major advances seem to come out of the North…..

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By: Blimpish http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13870 Thu, 25 May 2006 17:48:52 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/2006/05/24/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13870 On the commercial property thing, I was talking about the effect of the public sector more generally on provincial markets. But, to be fair, moving Central Government out of London would probably eat up all and more of the commercial property stock available there, driving up costs and therefore making business there less competitive.

In terms of ‘regional skills shortages’, hmph. First, they’re not as big as the political rhetoric tends to suggest (mainly because the economy outside the London and the South East is typically quite undynamic).

But yes, you’re right that the problem I allude to is partly one of people moving to where the money is – but it’s also a problem that those remaining then work in the public sector. In order for your proposal to have a beneficial effect, it would have to substantially reverse that flow of people to London more than it increases the demands on the higher skilled workforce.

But that ain’t gonna’ happen. The reason why public employment is quite evenly distributed among the regions is that most of it is in local government and in regional offspring of central departments. The additional numbers employed in London that you could move out probably aren’t that big anyway, and you’re also assuming that London’s labour market isn’t strong enough that the supply couldn’t just trigger more demand – bearing in mind that a large number might choose to stay in London and the South East anyway, given that their lives are there.

In terms of its long-term effects, the examples of Washington, Canberra, etc., show that a political capital city does not an economic dynamo make.

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By: Steve http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13859 Thu, 25 May 2006 14:36:13 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/2006/05/24/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13859 Jasper, there is something about Elizabetha in this article:

http://archive.thisisyork.co.uk/2002/11/28/277302.html

Apparently Norman Macrae and Alastair Burnet proposed the idea in 1962. I plead ignorance on the grounds that I wasn’t born then.

Blimpish – I don’t follow your logic. Wouldn’t commercial property benefit from the increased demand brought about by shifting the government?
Isn’t the regional skills shortage brought about by people moving south because that’s where most of the senior jobs are, both in the public and private sector?

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By: Alex http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13852 Thu, 25 May 2006 11:23:46 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/2006/05/24/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13852 I’m in. Sounds like a great idea. I seem to recall some fool suggesting back in the .com boom that London should become an independent state, as a sort of hyper-eurosceptic wank fantasy. I recall saying that it was a fine idea, and our watchtowers would fit nicely on the M25 embankments.

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By: chris http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13851 Thu, 25 May 2006 09:38:57 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/2006/05/24/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13851 Given Britians maritime heritage perhaps we could move them to a ship in the middle of the Atlantic. They could spend their time creating the perfect system for the sun loungers, telegraphing home the occasional short bill. Then everybody else could just get on with their lives with much less government interference.

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By: Jasper Milvain http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13850 Thu, 25 May 2006 09:19:22 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/2006/05/24/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13850 This sounds like Elizabetha, the capital in the Pennines that The Economist proposed in the sixties (Prospect has the original article behind a paywall here).

Given the objections coming up at the moment, though, you might be better moving the Square Mile to Elizabetha and leaving Westminster where it is. Assuming that the Square Mile would let itself be moved, of course…

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By: Dave http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13844 Wed, 24 May 2006 23:14:19 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/2006/05/24/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13844 London isn’t the economic centre by accident, and if the North would stop voting for socialists their people wouldn’t have to keep moving South to get jobs.

In some of those northern towns well over 50% of employment is by the state..

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By: Blimpish http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13842 Wed, 24 May 2006 22:56:38 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/2006/05/24/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13842 Well, the main problem is that the location of government isn’t necessarily as influential on the structure of economic activity as we can think it is. Think of Washington, Canberra, Abuja, Brasilia – all purpose built political capital cities which are dwarfed by other cities in their respective countries.

But the bigger problems are about the economic consequences. Phil E rightly points out the distorting effects of regeneration: I remember being told two years ago by a regeneration official that over the next decade most provincial cities seem set to become so dependent on public funds that unsubsidised commercial property wouldn’t have much of a chance.

At any rate, despite the presence of the departments’ HQs in London, public employment is pretty evenly spread, with London under-represented if anything. Public administration workers as % of the employed workforce ranges from 26% (East) to 32% (North East), with London (27%) below the national average (28%). (2005 LFS data)

There’s a bigger problem here though – that the public administration workforce absorbs higher skilled workers in areas which don’t have many of them. If we compare the public administration workforce with those holding Level 3+ qualifications (e.g., 2 A-levels or above), we see that London has the smallest share – only 50% compared to a whopping 67% in Wales or 71% in the North East.

Does this matter? Damn right it does. Labour markets in places like Wales and the North East are dominated by public employment, making it difficult to find people to staff higher-value businesses. If this effect carried on, taking central government out of London could serve to exacerbate the North-South divide over the longer term.

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By: Jack Asher http://sharpener.johnband.org/2006/05/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13840 Wed, 24 May 2006 21:59:38 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/2006/05/24/time-to-move-the-capital/#comment-13840 Somewhere in the midlands would seem like a good idea. Birmingham could definitely do with an injection of capital.

Oh and I for one am unashamedly Anglo centric – I’d like it to be an exclusively English affair.

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