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Comments on: Is Osama right? http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/ Trying to make a point Fri, 25 Jan 2008 12:21:35 +0000 hourly 1 By: MrSpamMe http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/#comment-14818 Thu, 08 Jun 2006 03:21:18 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=47#comment-14818 Andrew, nosemonkey, good points.

If someone like the BNP, HuT spout nonsense, you are going to have to argue against it anyway. Might as well make it legal, so we can hear it and answer it quick, than leave it to fester through rumour in a series of back rooms.

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By: osama bin laden http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/#comment-11739 Sat, 13 May 2006 21:45:13 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=47#comment-11739 i am bin ladens new hit man and donnot fuck me about muslims aint terrorists or rapists white bastards are don’t you see the news everyday white people are guilty for raping

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By: Sean Fear http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/#comment-375 Thu, 19 May 2005 17:08:48 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=47#comment-375 Inciting people to commit criminal offences against other people is already an offence. That is all the legal protection that any individual requires.

Until this law has been tested in the courts, nobody knows what will and what will not be banned. Given that many Muslims have cited the Satanic Verses as an example of something that would be caught under this legislation, it’s hard to see how it won’t have a chilling effect on free speech.

In Australia, there is a similar law on the statute books. A Pakistani Christian convert from Islam was successfully prosecuted for describing how Pakistani apostates from Islam could be murdered with impunity in that country. Is it your view, David, that saying something like that, which is true, but could arouse hostility to Muslims generally, should be made a criminal offence?

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By: Rob Read http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/#comment-373 Thu, 19 May 2005 17:03:13 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=47#comment-373 How about “I love Terrorism, Isn’t it great how so many Muslims are so commited to their religion, they’ll kill civilians, like it says in that great book the Koran (the one that doesn’t flush).”?

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By: dearieme http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/#comment-359 Thu, 19 May 2005 09:37:31 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=47#comment-359 My question wasn’t answered: What are your general rules on what should be censored and who should decide? Let me give more examples. Would it be illegal to say
1) We fought the Kosovo war on behalf of a bunch of moslem terrorists?
2) We fought the Afghan war against a bunch of Islamic terrorists?
3) The 19th and 20th century formalisation of the peasant superstition of Mary-worship into the RC church was foolish, disgraceful and unchristian?
4) Archaeology suggests that much of the Old Testament is unhistorical bilge?

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By: Nosemonkey http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/#comment-355 Thu, 19 May 2005 08:39:32 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=47#comment-355 Yep – that’s pretty much my policy. Hence no real censorship over at my place – even when the BNP descend. The more they spout nonsense, the more the fact that it’s nonsense becomes obvious.

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By: Andrew http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/#comment-354 Thu, 19 May 2005 08:13:26 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=47#comment-354 The solution is not censorship – the solution is better education.

I’d go further. Some people will hold obnoxious views even after a lengthy period of re-education. The solution then is to allow them to proclaim their views from the rooftops. Ridicule will do the rest.

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By: Nosemonkey http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/#comment-348 Wed, 18 May 2005 21:49:31 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=47#comment-348 Just a quick reminder to those who advocate any form of censorship:

Because of such “moral” shit-stirring, James Joyce’s Ulysses – one of the defining cultural artefacts of the 20th century whether you’ve read it or not (and I suggest you do) – was banned in the United States between 1920 and 1933, its publishers convicted of obscenity purely for some brief sexual sequences which by today’s standards are incredibly tame.

Because of such “moral” shit-stirring, Stanley Kubrick voluntarily withdrew A Clockwork Orange – an important if not especially good film – from the UK simply to avoid the hassle of the Mary Whitehouses of this world. It remained unavailable to UK audiences until after his death – while being freely available throughout the rest of the world and not causing any massive disintegration of society as its critics claimed it would.

Any kind of censorship, any kind of restriction to freedom of expression by definition stifles creativity. If you stifle creativity, your culture – such that remains – will begin to stagnate.

Which is hardly a good thing, I think we can all agree.

And – beyond all of that – what the hell right does the government have to tell us what we can and can’t say or think? I despise racism and bigotry – but I will always defend the right of racists and bigots to hold their stupid views. The solution is not censorship – the solution is better education.

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By: Andrew http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/#comment-343 Wed, 18 May 2005 16:49:00 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=47#comment-343 But if the aggrevied cant bring a civil charge, then what do artists have to fear?

Well, trivially – criminal charges. If these ‘offences’ are reported to the police, they have a duty to investigate. That process is intrusive, and in some cases, it will go to court. It only takes one case to promote a media witchhunt.

It is not the law that is the problem. It is the perception of the law. Witness the debate over the amount of violence it is allowable to dole out to someone you catch filching your DVD player.

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By: anonymous http://sharpener.johnband.org/2005/05/was-osama-right/#comment-342 Wed, 18 May 2005 16:31:38 +0000 http://www.thesharpener.net/?p=47#comment-342 We are beginning to see the magnitude of stupidity
that adopting hate crime legislation involved.
The overwhelming majority of the public were quite happy,imo, to see miscreants punished for their actions rather than any perceived motivations.
The existing legislation provided for this.
Now we see tailor made legislation which infers that a criminal activity perpetrated against an individual who is not a member of a “special interest group” is less heinous than a similar offence against a “special interest group”
member.
The religous incitement legislation is a further example of, both ,preferential treatment and
labours overt attempts to curry favour with
“special interest groups”.
So to answer the question is OBL right?
The response is no but Labour’s stupidity has made it appear so.

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